Of course, there could be other problems such as a seized compressor or a blocked expansion valve. The major difference between these two refrigerants is their chemical composition. Reattach the hose lines using new R134a compatible o-rings, lightly lubricate with compressor oil. These attributes make it very attractive for domestic refrigeration. R12 is CFC: Even though R12 is one of the most commonly used refrigerants, it is CFC. In most cases, the systems used have varied components, designs, and service ports. As long as the compressor was working well, it could be drained, filled with R134a-compatible oil, and reused. It is also used in automotive car conditioning and the plastic industry. Also, if you want to know what happens if you put R134a in an R12 system, you should first confirm if the R12 system can be replaced or if the refrigerants can be mixed. I wouldnt say Im a BMW enthusiast. R12 is highly destructive to the earths ozone layer. This can significantly affect energy consumption as the plant will operate for longer, or a larger plant will have to be installed. R12 is recognized as a very stable compound, and it wont break down under even the most stringent conditions, but if it comes in contact with flames or electrical heating elements, it breaks down into toxic components. R134a is safe to use as its not toxic, flammable, or explosive. A/C R12-to-R12a Refrigerant Recharge Results - Forums Pound for pound R134a is a more efficient refrigerant than R12, however it runs at higher pressures in some aspects and therefore requires more effective condensing. On the other hand, R12 has a global warming potential of 10,910. For R12, its mineral oil. Anyone selling R12 is required to verify that the buyer has an EPA Section 609 certification to work with mobile vehicle air conditioning (MVAC) systems. There is R744, which is literally carbon dioxide (CO2). As these refrigerants are slowly phased out, there are still many questions that people have about them. PDF A Comparison Between Refrigerants Used In Air Conditioning However, you need calibrated gauges for R410A. Also worth noting is that the R-600a requires a shorter time to reach -21C (60 minutes) compared to the R-134a (135 minutes) [1]. Theyre also tasteless, colorless, and odorless. BTW Im sorta tempted to buy one of your BMW 2002 cars. A comparison between R12 vs. R134a temperature will show that R12 has a higher temperature than R134a. This chemical is tetrafluoroethane, and its chemical formula is CH2FCF3. Google use cookies for serving our ads and handling visitor statistics. Some compressor manufacturers or OEMs suggest PAG type oil for R134a. Second, as youll see below, if you have to perform work on an A/C system that has refrigerant in it, it is illegal to vent the refrigerant (to let it escape into the atmosphere); it must be captured and recovered. For instance at 25 F the pressure of R-12 is 24.6 PSI and the pressure of R-134a is 22.1 PSI. Theyve moved away from using R12 in favor of more modern, environmentally safer products. Motor manufacturers in the USA used R134a in air conditioning systems for new cars from 1994. r134a vs r12 manifold gauges.. - Slant Six Forum Part # LX-14. R134a is not an ozone-destroying agent, but it is a greenhouse gas, and is illegal to vent as well. Environmental Impact: When R134a escapes into the atmosphere, it contributes to global warming. R12 has a global warming potential factor of 2400. The following is verbatim from EPAs website: EPA performs random inspections, responds to tips, and pursues potential cases against violators of the Section 608 regulations. How to Convert Your Car AC R12 System to R134a Many commercial enterprises that run large chillers or transport companies running reefer trailers or containers have used R12 as its a highly efficient refrigerant that provides excellent cooling. Theres no doubt that R12 refrigerant is one of the first compounds manufactured for the air conditioning and refrigeration world, but it had to be banned. This means when lowering temperatures to -7C or below, theres a noticeable drop in the plants ability to chill the air. Refrigerant for domestic & commercial use, Mainly used in the automotive industry but can be used as a refrigerant for domestic and commercial use, Has excellent cooling properties and performs at a similar level to R134A, Has excellent cooling properties and performs at a similar level to R12. You can get it and use it. Diagnosis of the air-conditioning system can be done in the same way as with R134a. The global warming potential measures the amount of heat trapped by any gas compared to the amount of heat trapped by the same amount of carbon dioxide. A/C professionals derisively called these death kits because they had a reputation for causing the compressor to seize a few months later. When the sensor detects the refrigerant leak the sniffers lights glow and the sniffer makes a noise. R134a has a boiling point of -14.9 degrees Fahrenheit, whereas R410 boils at -61.9 degrees. Hence, the effect of R12 on global warming is up to 10,000 times higher than carbon dioxide. Refrigerant Can Leak Easier For starters, R12 systems and R134a systems are designed differently to accommodate the gaseous state of each. Home Air Conditioners R12 vs R134a Refrigerant: What is the Difference? This is an electronic tool that sucks in air through a tube and across a sensor. However, the operating pressures are reportedly four times those of other refrigerants, so retrofit appears out of the question. Which brings us to. Its often said that R12 is no longer available. Its among the greenhouse gases and will keep adding the current problem of heat not leaving the earths atmosphere. Providing they dont leak, theyre no risk to the environment. Why racetracks are giving hybrids and EVs the cold shoulder, Rearview cameras have been around longer than you think, At $720,000, this Ferrari 550 Barchetta Pininfarina is looking for its top, For roadster lovers, Mazdas Miata is (still) the answer, National Council of Corvette Clubs lifts competition ban on E-Ray, How fast is the Corvette E-Ray? We are an automotive mechanic blog that helps mechanics and car users to find the most recent and accurate technical and repair information for their cars. At this point it is time to make an appointment with the a/c shop. The 7 Best HVAC Manifold Gauges 2023 Reviews & Buying Guide R12, on the other hand, has an ozone depletion potential of 1, implying that it can damage the ozone layer. Therefore, the R12 refrigerant is illegal, and emitting it is illegal. After the system has been tested out it should be checked for leaks. This should give you a rough idea of how much youll need. Its not illegal to own this product, but with it being withdrawn from use in so many countries, its no longer manufactured. First things first. Its legal to own either of these gasses, but its illegal to vent them into the air. Over time, a credible middle ground emerged. Additionally, R134a was introduced as a replacement for R22 and R12 in high and medium-temperature refrigeration systems like domestic and commercial chillers. Bottom line, R134a simply doesn't cool as well as R12. Even though their common major function is to cool the system, they have many differences. Quote Minuit Members 5.1k An R134a-specific expansion valve was preferred but not strictly necessary. His new book, Just Needs a Recharge: The Hack Mechanic Guide to Vintage Air Conditioning, is now available on Amazon. Its been labeled as a greenhouse gas, and its use is no longer supported. When you add fluorescent tracer dye to with the refrigerant oil it helps to track down leaks that push oil out of the system. R134a refrigerant is lighter than R12. Another difference is that yf Evaporators must meet SAE Spec J2842, which was not an issue in R-134a systems. If the oil didnt dissolve into the refrigerant, it would reduce the refrigerants ability to transfer heat. Difference Between R-134a and R-410A Refrigerants? 2021 Complete Guide, Find more info about me and HVAC Training 101, Screw, roll, rotary, reciprocating, and centrifugal compressors for refrigeration and air conditioning, Used in automotive air conditioning since 1994, and has been retrofitted to many older models as a replacement to R12, Used to remove humidity from compressed air in gas dusters. This drop can affect energy consumption since the plant will operate for a longer period or a larger plant will have to be installed. These are cars with poor A/C reputations, which is precisely why I continue to use R12 in them. Servicing automotive a/c systems: The difference between R-134a and R On the other hand, R12 has a global warming potential of 10,910. 2001-2023 Griffiths Technical Inc. All Rights Reserved. If youre resurrecting the A/C in a vintage car, the vast majority of the time the refrigerant has long since leaked out, but if your car has refrigerant in it, and you need to open up the A/C system to work on it, spend a little money and take the car to an A/C shop. R12 is highly destructive of the ozone layer, and R134a is over 1,000 times more dangerous in terms of global warming than carbon dioxide. Get it as soon as Thursday, Apr 20. Chemistry. In addition, there was the lubricant issue. Inhalation of vapor: Inhaling a large amount of R134a vapor can lead to drowsiness, temporary nervous system depression, and lethargy. Start the car again and add R12A to bring the low side pressure to about 32 psi. Instead of using R12, its preferable to use R134a because it is very easy to find in the market, its sold at an affordable price, and is environmentally friendly. R134a vs. R12 - Griffiths Piston Slap: Booting a Torino in a snap without snaps? Dont do it. This is why it is crucially important that R134a systems be properly evacuated (pumped down to boil off any moisture) and kept sealed. A simple rule of thumb conversion would be to take the amount of R12 refrigerant your system requires, in pounds, and multiply by 0.9 (your answer should be 90% of the R12 value). I have never see the other way around. The major environmental impact of this refrigerant escaping into the atmosphere is its contribution to global warming. To ensure the right charge, you must fill the new system with between 75 and 85% of the factory-set capacity for optimal cooling. Alternator Overcharging - Causes and Fixes. In the last 10 years, new information has shown that this gas contributes to global warming. This means that the mineral oil in the system wont dissolve. The issue is whether you should. These guidelines are offered tohelp understand the differences . It provided much needed context as I embark on re-building the AC in my sons new (to him) 1988 Toyota pickup. I think that, with hindsight, many people would agree that, even given that R12 is an ozone-destroying agent, fines of this level made many hard-working A/C technicians hostile to the government, and thus were counterproductive. With that said, Ill agree that the flammability issue may not be as black-and-white as it appears. This gas is then cooled via environmental means, and the gas slowly loses heat and reverts to a liquid state. From this number, subtract 1/4, or 0.25 pounds. Its a safe product for use in a variety of domestic and commercial environments. R134a was touted as the replacement for R12 until it too was deemed environmentally undesirable. There are significant differences between R12, R134a, and R513A, which must be considered when handling, processing, applying, or retrofitting with these refrigerants. R134a Expansion valve different from R12? - Automotive Air Conditioning R134a is called tetrafluoroethane (HFC). SKU # 532244. . R134a has an ozone depletion potential of 0, implying that it has a slight effect on the ozone layer. Because R-12 is no longer manufactured and has not been used in cars for over 20 years, this article will focus on systems designed for R-134a. R134a is a newer type of refrigerant that has some significant advantages. Each has its own cult following and requires its own EPA-approved charging fittings. The Difference Between Refrigerants R134A and R410A Gas? As a result, each refrigerant's system requirements are quite . R134a systems operate at higher discharge-side pressures than R12, which can cause compressor seals to leak. But, if your car lacks enough condenser and you have many 100+ degree days then you may want to stick either increase air flow, add another condenser as we mentioned in The Mr. Ice Project or stick with R12. Hopefully Ive properly conveyed that, if the A/C in your precious vintage car is long-dead, the question isnt whether you choose between buying a few NOS cans of R12 and shooting them in (seriously dont do that) or converting to R134a. Weve been talking about air conditioning for a couple of weeks now, so if youre still feeling the heat then its time to wrap up the series so you can get out to your garage and put what youve learned to good use. It is made up of carbon, hydrogen, and fluorine. Most vehicles manufactured before 1993 have the R12 A/C system. In a comparison between R12 vs R134a vs R1234yf, R1234yf will pass as the best refrigerant. Bottom line, R134a simply doesn't cool as well as R12. Oil doesnt stay in the compressor, however, it dissolves in the liquid refrigerant and gets carried through the system as a fine particulate mist when the refrigerant goes through its liquid/gaseous transition. Lets take you through the advantages, disadvantages, and differences of these two refrigerants a detailed comparison including R12 vs R134a performance. The problem is that some inexpensive available refrigerantsammonia and propane, for exampleare poisonous and/or flammable. Servicing: When payment of any kind is involved (including non-monetary), any person working on an MVAC system must be certified under section 609 of the Clean Air Act (CAA) and they must use approved refrigerant handling equipment. I can tell you that R12 is some seriously great refrigerant; it gets both of these cars meat-locker cold almost from the instant the A/C is turned on. This is measured using a factor known as ODP (ozone depletion potential). R134a has a smaller molecule than R12 so R134a will leak out sooner than R12. In contrast, the most likely reason youd consider recharging with an alternative refrigerant is because the refrigerant leaked out of your car and youre trying to avoid doing a full-on A/C rejuvenation which includes finding the leak and properly changing refrigerants. Santech R12 to R134a Coupler . The best replacement for R134a is R1234yf, while R12 refrigerant replacement was R134a. With the knowledge of the differences, youll be able to draw a comparison between R12 vs R134a efficiency. This chemical has carbon, hydrogen, and fluorine. R134a vs R12 refrigerant? Because this recipe was quite expensive, a backlash developed which gave companies an opportunity to sell conversion kits consisting of nothing but the charging port adapters and a small bottle of oil that was somehow magically supposed to make your mineral oil R134a-compatible. In addition, there is a $10,000 rat-out fee your neighbor can collect if youre venting refrigerant and he tattles on you. Wise Auto Tools - Convert R12 Gauge Set to R134A - YouTube Air-conditioning dos and don'ts: Refrigerants and the law R12 has an ODP of 1, meaning that it has the highest potential to destroy the ozone layer. However, there are some drawbacks to using this type as well. R12 fitting vs. R134a - Garage Addicted Some recovery machines are equipped for both R134a and R1234yf. 135, three new EPA-approved climate-friendly alternatives., Installing a lift pump in a Duramax diesel. The common problem when converting from R12 to R134a is lack of knowledge or equipment. Lets have a closer look at these similarities and differences. R12 and R134a are not the only game in town. If an A/C system isnt working, the root cause needs to be diagnosed, and the system needs to be fixed. R12 is known as a CFC or chlorofluorocarbon, with a chemical symbol of CCl2F2. However, theyre still used in older plants, systems, and the automotive industry. This makes it expensive to purchase and adds to the attraction of replacing it with other greener products. We chose to use 5-6 ounces of oil to be on the safe side: 3-4 ounces for the compressor, 1 oz of oil for the drier and another ounce of oil for system losses. Since you will be using less R134a than R12 you do not want to rely on the driers site glass to determine if the system is full. Well worth the money if your A/C system is still in good shape. We learned the theory behind refrigeration and air conditioning, which centers on this wonderfully useful bit of physics: When liquid boils and evaporates into a gas, it expands and cools. Theres a lot of misinformation surrounding R12. R12 is a powerful ozone depleted, while R134a and R1234yf are not. . The problem with these so called drop in replacements is that to properly handle them you may need dedicated equipment to identify the gas and evacuate it for proper disposal. This boiling point means that itll condense with moderate pressure, so applications can use a lower pressure condenser to achieve the same results. In sum, R12 has done more bad than good. R-12 isn't just unfriendly to the ozone layer, it has a GWP value of 10,900! Find more info about me and HVAC Training 101. But many European cars, such as the vintage BMWs I love, had A/C systems that never functioned all that well even when they were new and charged up with R12. Buy online for free next day delivery or same day pickup at a store near you. Interestingly, theres one oil type that works perfectly with both types of refrigerants. 5 foreign cars that were copied from American style. If it splashes inside the eye, it could lead to a serious eye problem. If he is not in the garage fixing challenging mechanical problems, he is writing automotive repair guides, buyers guides, and car and tools comparisons. Welcome to rxmechanic.com. Certainly no one selling cans of R12 on Craigslist is asking for your EPA 609 card. This means that this compound is made up of carbon, chlorine, and fluorine. The reason is that the vehicles, for instance, manufactured currently configure the engine for R1234yf refrigerant, making no provision for replacement. Osuagwu Solomon is a certified mechanic with over a decade of experience in the mechanic garage, and he has over five years of experience in the writing industry. The first vehicle that used the R1234yf refrigerant was the 2013 Cadillac XTS. You can then add ester oil thatll work with either R12 or R134a. Before landing on the debate of R134 vs R12 you should know that both R134a and R12 are AC refrigerants types used in refrigeration and air conditioning systems. In the case of R134a, its the global warming potential thats an issue. Older fridges and air conditioning units that use this refrigerant will still work efficiently, and converting them to more modern refrigerants will be difficult and unrealistically expensive. Price is reasonable Consistent and accurate Note that there is another kind of oil called Polyol Ester Oil (POE). Versus Ferrari F8 & Lamborghini Huracan Evo Cammisas Ultimate Drag Race Replay, Ultra RARE: Colin Chapmans Lotus Eleven + 327 Corvette Stingray with 4-speed | Barn Find Hunter Ep. Hopefully after you have read this entire page you will have enough information to determine which type of refrigerant is best for you. Also, they are mostly used in refrigeration and automotive air conditioning systems. In contrast, older CFC refrigerants had an ODP of 1. Like R12, this product is non-toxic, non-flammable, and not explosive. As this chemical has both chlorine and fluorine in its make-up, it belongs to the group of chemicals known as CFCs or chlorofluorocarbons. R134a is classified as a dangerous greenhouse gas that contributes to global warming. Swapping the components isnt a herculean task, but recharging the AC is a challenge. A significant investment. It also means that rotary, centrifugal, and reciprocating compressors can be used with R12. It has already been clearly stated that R12 is a chemical that damages the earths ozone layer and shouldnt be released into the environment no matter the circumstance. $34.99. R134A does not deplete the ozone layer of the earth as it is a CFC refrigerant. No one here will work on it, he said. These factors make it a safe product for a technician to work with. Converting these plants to run modern refrigerants will be extremely expensive, and in many cases, mean complete replacement; these plants will likely continue to run for many years. Refrigerant: Must be EPA-approved and cannot be intentionally released (vented) into the environment. If your a/c system is empty/low on refrigerant, if your system has a leak or if you need to open the system, then now is the time to decide which refrigerant you want to use. There are other EPA-approved refrigerants such as Hot Shot and Freeze 12, which you can find here. R12 is considered to be superior in cooling to R134a. R134a belongs to the family of HFCs or hydrofluorocarbons. rate between the temperature range of -40 C and -10 C is R134a liquid's, while the lowest is the R1270's. Having a low mass flow rate with in the system is a parameter that reduces the cost of operating. In addition, R134a refrigerants are not only used in auto air conditioners, they can be used in freezers, aerosol cans, and refrigerators. Compatible with multiple applications: The major reason for the introduction of R134a was to replace R12, so it functions perfectly in the same range of applications like rotary, screw, and centrifugal compressors for air conditioning and refrigeration. Ensure you contact a professional mechanic to do the work for you so you dont end up incurring more costs for yourself. Any new installation of refrigeration or air conditioning wont use R134a as a refrigerant as the production and importation of this gas to the US has been banned. These applications will - due to browser restrictions - send data between your browser and our server. However, it must be noted that itll disintegrate into toxic compounds when exposed to flame. R134a is a pure refrigerant that is sometimes used in blends, while R410a is itself a blend. All in all, I'm very happy with the results and see no reason why they won't last. These properties make it popular for domestic and commercial refrigeration. This means that it has a high potential of causing depletion to the ozone layer. A comparison between R12 vs. R134a temperature will show that R12 has a higher temperature than R134a. Hand in hand with this is the global warming potential (GWP), which measures the gass potential as a greenhouse gas. Next, add a can of R12a from the low side fitting while running your A/C. This means that the tiny droplets of oil from the compressor that end up in the refrigerant will be returned via the compressors refrigerant; they wont block pipes. Hell, its possible that not all of the original A/C components are even there anymore. Subtract or 0.25 pounds from this number. Safety: R134a is safe to use as its non-flammable and cant explode. So the oil must be compatible with the refrigerant. Since you cant vent any refrigerant without breaking the law, and since youll be hard-pressed to find a shop that will recover anything other than R134a, youll have painted yourself into a corner. Amazon.com: Lichamp HVAC R410A Manifold Gauge Set AC R134A, Freon R22 However, if it is taken close to a fire flame or any electrical heating element, it disintegrates into toxic products. R134A has an ODP of zero, meaning that it has a negligible effect on the ozone layer. Gauges are used to read the pressure of various liquids and gases in a cooling system, as well as vacuum pressure in the process of testing or charging the device. And it was safeneither poisonous to breathe, nor flammable. The typical scenario here is when the car owner buys an inexpensive retro-fit kit from the local auto parts store. This means that this compound is made up of carbon, chlorine, and fluorine. Once you take these precautions, it would be possible to use R134A gauges R410A systems seamlessly. However, leaks do occur. This product is safe to use in that its not toxic, flammable, or explosive. dye and seal. R134a isnt toxic, corrosive, explosive, or flammable, making it a good choice for air conditioning, but its cooling properties arent as good as R12. Condensers designed to release greater amounts of heat help to expel the greater amount of heat which R134a removes from the cars interior. First, it is a pernicious ozone-destroying agent, so if you are going to use it in a car, you are morally required to do everything under the sun to thoroughly leak-test the system before charging it with R12. If you you dont have the free time to play then you are better off to pay a technician. Yes, theres a certain irony in the fact that weve gone full-circle from the invasive youll need to replace almost everything including the compressor and hoses in order to properly convert R12 to R134a to you dont need to replace all that much; just flush it, new oil, new drier and o-rings, and back to youll need to replace almost everything including the compressor, hoses, and the condenser. But this change has occurred both because the cars are that much older than they were when the R12 to R134a change occurred in the mid-1990s, and there is now a better understanding of the need to take advantage of updated compressors and condensers in order to get the A/C systems to blow adequately cold with R134a. Theyre older generation refrigerants that have some serious environmental factors against them. This ability has encouraged R12 in a wide variety of applications and over a wide range of temperature variables. Awareness of Changing Refrigerant Types - I-CAR Statisicaly your friend was lucky. The 10 Best Air Conditioning Gauges To Buy - May 2023 Edition - We Kompare R12 vs R134a Refrigerant: What is the Difference? - 2022 Complete Guide They behave in the same way when used in any form of refrigeration or air conditioning plant. Usually, mechanics charge around $200 for conversion. Ive always liked them. The problem was that there was not agreement on exactly what was required for the conversion. If you are replacing other system components, such as condensers, driers or hoses, you may need to add more a/c refrigerant oil to the system. R134a is otherwise called 1,1,1,2 Tetrafluoroethane, Florasol 134a, Freon 134a, Norflurane (INN) or HFC 134a. The major reason for the replacement of R12 with R134a was to curb future greenhouse effects. Both of these products are refrigerants. By noting the ambient temperature you can look up what the preferred high side pressure should be. Remove the old mineral oil from the compressor by turning it upside down, side to side, and turn the front hub on the clutch assembly. For instance you can evacuate FRIGC FR-12 into a refrigerant recovery bottle that has R134a in it or visa versa. And with R134a costing only two bucks a can, converting to the new inexpensive refrigerant seemed the thing to do. That doesnt mean to say that there are still many thousands of existing installations that are running refrigeration plants using this refrigerant to cool them. Thats simply not true. Thats not true either. For those of you who are considering what the cost is for R12 you can think of it this way: Dont go out to dinner this weekend. R134a is the most widely accepted alternative automotive refrigerant used to replace R12. All these industries still have old plants that use these refrigerants. But once youre on that path, you can improve the system with a new compressor and parallel-flow condenser which, in most cases, will allow you to get good results with R134a. This means that the oil used in the system must be compatible with the refrigerant in use. If you still find it difficult to use R134a in a home AC system, you can check out a comparison of R12 vs R134a fittings to know the refrigerant that best fits the AC system.

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